Quoting skipnet50:

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I understand that by some European naming standards PBH would likely be P//BH, but despite their apparent belief to the contrary, their standards are not Universal nor or the naming standards (such as they are) that are used in the United States. However when talking about an American born actor and or anyone working in film, attempting to parse names by some arcne system which might be used in Transylvania just doesn't fly.

I don't really see how your argument is relevant. The US in not the center of the world. Most of Europe (which is MUCH bigger than the US) uses a different naming convention and other parts of the world use others still. The US is not even the largest single producer of films, let alone bigger than everyone else put together as your words seem to imply. The US name model is not a very good one in the world view, and the blind application of a rule designed with the US model in mind is not going to produce good results.

I think that being more open to foreign ideas would do you a world of good, and avoiding statements that belittle people who don't agree with your standpoint would probably help to alleviate some of the "unwarranted insults and attacks" you seem concerned about.

Stuart

This is ridiculous.

We cannot base the parsing of names on: "Some countries usually use this convention" or "I think it should be part of the 1st name" etc

I've said it before and I'll say it again.
This is DVD Profiler NOT Family Tree profiler.

We must come up with a standard starting point for parsing names that EVERYONE can comprehend without guesswork.

The simplest and easiest to follow is: First Name\Anything Inbetween\Last Name

If there's documentation that proves that the parsing should not be the default as above, then fine, parse it as the documentation proves. But under no circumstances should we leave parsing to guesswork. We must have a 'Standard' start point.

Please remember that a 'good' 'common' name should link the roles and be found easily when using the actor filter. No other criteria (eg Cultural Conventions) are relevant as far as the intended function of names within DVDProfiler are concerned.

If you want proper family names and forenames etc, then I suggest you look around for "Gene Profiler"

Quoting Gadgeteer:

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The simplest and easiest to follow is: First Name\Anything Inbetween\Last Name

Sure, we could do that. It wouldn't make much sense, but it would work. Although I wouldn't like the result, I'd support this, just to get a standard. But I repeat: then the term "middle name" should be removed from DVD Profiler immediately.

As long as the field is called "middle name", I'm only going to enter things into it that I feel are real "middle names", and nothing else. Added bonus of changing the name of the field would be that we immediately get rid of exceptions like Helena Bonham Carter - as the field would then be called "Anything Inbetween" or something to that effect ( ), there'd be no exceptions anymore, all names could/would/should be parsed exactly the same. Again: while I still feel that losing the "middle name" field entirely would be a better solution, I agree that this proposal would actually WORK and get all users in all localities on the same page. Therefore, I'd be willing to support it - but only if we lose the term "middle name".

As long as the field is called "middle name", I can not, and will not arbitrarily chuck "anything inbetween" into the field, and based on what I see in the database throughout the various localities, neither will a LOT of users - most of which don't regularly visit these forums. Even though the usual (mostly U.S.) suspects on this forum will no doubt ensure the "poll victory" of Rupert/Henry Penrose/Smith, that doesn't solve the problem. I'm still very much convinced that as long as the field is called "middle name", quite a number of people will use it for what they consider a "middle name", and for nothing else.

Quoting skipnet50:

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I have repeatedly outlined the simplest and neutral standard

Your standard may be simple but it defintely isn't neutral. And it is not covered by the rules. Actually the rules give no standard at all besides the names of the fields.

Quoting Gadgeteer:

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The simplest and easiest to follow is: First Name\Anything Inbetween\Last Name

Correct! But last name is not equal to the last word. Sometimes we have to research and if not successful guess what's the last name.

Quoting RHo:

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Quoting Gadgeteer:

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...If there's documentation that proves that the parsing should not be the default as above,...

There is no default parsing of words into these fields.

Not at the moment. But I was suggesting a 'standard' that we could adopt and add to the rules.

Quoting Rifter:

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do it by the rules

How many times must we tell you: the rules give no standard at all besides the names of the fields. If you insist on depending on the rules or the software to give you a default, then you only get the fact that the field is called "middle name", not "anything inbetween the first and last words". Also: try and enter a new three-piece name into DVD Profiler, click "add cast member", and see what the "default" positions are. Ken could have easily made another choice there, but he didn't. Anyway, I'm not saying we should read anything into that, but these are the only hints the rules and the software give us. Both the choice of name for the field nor these "default" positions do not really hint towards blindly chucking everything in the middle of a name into the "middle name" field, do they? In any case, your "do it by the rules" is useless...

I repeat: as long as the field is called "middle name", we'll never solve this. It needs to be either removed, or renamed (with some further clarification in the rules, preferably).

Quoting T!M:

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Quoting Gadgeteer:

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But I was suggesting a 'standard' that we could adopt and add to the rules.

Again: I'm willing to support any 'standard', even if I don't like it personally, as long as we lose the term "middle name". If it stays, there will always be people who'll use it for what they consider actual "middle names", and for nothing else. Regardless of who's right or wrong on any particular name (which in most cases will be impossible to document), we need to end this once and for all. That is simply not possible if the field remains labeled "middle name". Either remove it, or rename it.

I disagree that we need to rename the fields. As long as we can get a standard implemented into the rules dictating how to parse the names then that should suffice.

Take the 'Production Year' field for instance. The rules say to put the Theatrical Release date, not the production year. That seems to work ok.

At the risk of repeating myself, we just need a common, understandable & indisputable default starting standard, with the provision of documentation to allow for differing from the default.

We must try to eliminate personal preference and guess work. There is no room for either in this database.