Quoting Daddy DVD:

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Quoting bbursiek:

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The only difference I can see is that one war was launched by a Democrat and the other by a Republican.

I can see a lot more on this page on the internet.

And you take those as truths? 

Let's take a closer look, shall we?

Clinton invades Kosovo, zero US combat losses.
Bush invades Iraq, 1,075 US service members dead and rising.

Clinton did not invade Kosovo.  The UN was responsible for the invasion of Kosovo.  In fact, while Clinton was happy to provide aircraft for bombing runs, he was extremely reluctant to commit American forces for a ground offensive.  It's pretty easy to avoid any combat losses when you are launching 'smart bombs' from several thousand feet in the air.

Clinton invades Kosovo and captures Milosevic.
Bush invades Afghanistan and lets Osama get away.

Again, Clinton did not invade Kosovo, neither did he capture Milosevic.  Milosevic surrendered to security forces after an assault on his villa.  It should also be noted that Sudanese President Omar Hassan Ahmed Bashir, hoping to have terrorism sanctions lifted, offered the arrest and extradition of bin Laden to the US.  Clinton declined the offer.

Clinton invades Kosovo, our troops have food and armor.
Bush invades Iraq, our troops are buying body armor on eBay and begging Iraqi civilians for food.

I should have said this earlier, but I will say it now, congress, not the president, was responsible for invading Iraq.  The US Constitution prevented the president from making this decision.  In addition, congress, not the president, is responsible for the lack of equipment supplied to our troops.  While they voted for the war, they voted against spending the money required to wage said war.

Should I go on or is that enough?  That article is filled with half truths and outright lies.  In short, it is a joke.

I haven't seen any Europeans applying for statehood. Many of us in the US believe that both we and the world is indeed safer, at least in part because of the actions of our president. Since we have no European states that I am aware of yet, I suggest that if you feel unsafe you look to your own leadership.

That said, there is Constitutionally spelled out system of applying for statehood, so if there are any European countries I will be more than happy to try and help.

If I recall we need 50,000 signatures on a petition which is then presented to Congress, and then to the states for ratification.

Skip

Quoting Daddy DVD:

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Quoting Unicus69:

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And you take those as truths?  ...That article is filled with half truths and outright lies.  In short, it is a joke.

I did not say it was the truth, now did I? This thread started with a joke, only to be dragged into some serious discussion I don't seem to understand. The one thing I do know for a fact is that the world hasn't become a better place since GWB became president and whether it's because of him or something else I don't know, but it sure looks that way to me (and a lot of other Europeans too).

Then you (and a lot of other Europeans) need to educate yourselves.  Our country is not run by a single person.  Yes, the president is our leader, but his power is controlled by congress.  It is that way by design to prevent one single person from having all the power.

If you think GW is to blame, then I am inclined to believe you do think that article is filled with truths.  To blame GW is to buy into all the misinformation.

Quoting goblinsdoitall:

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But if I didn't get the privileges of your president totally wrong, then he is allowed to send troops into a conflict without the affirmation of the congress. The congress has to affirm this after a given time period though (I think it was 15 days, but I'm not sure about this).

This is a hot topic for debate.  Technically, the U.S. Constitution empowers the president to wage wars as commander-in-chief while Congress has the power to declare wars and fund them. Where things get fuzzy is in the deployment of military power.

Many presidents have played the 'it's not a war so I don't need approval' game.  Whether or not it is constitutional depends on who you ask.

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And if I recall this correctly the second Iraq war was started under this premises. But I might be wrong here.

You are, indeed, wrong here.  Congress gave the president permission to go to war in October of 2002.  That war did not begin until March of 2003.

Affirmative.

Rory

I must say I disagree as much with your generalizations as with Lord's.

I'd just like to exclude myself from your "we here in Europe" as I don't see myself reflected in many of your opinions (which you have the right to both have and publicize, just not of generalize as the opinion of all Europeans).

I most strongly disagree with the tone you used for stating your opinion and several of the offensive adjectives used. (Regardless of my political views)


P.S.- In case you haven't noticed the excessively strong €uro is killing our exports and getting many European companies in severe troubles. But that would be a completely different discussion.

Quoting goblinsdoitall:

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Quoting Unicus69:

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Then you (and a lot of other Europeans) need to educate yourselves.  Our country is not run by a single person.  Yes, the president is our leader, but his power is controlled by congress.  It is that way by design to prevent one single person from having all the power.

Yes, that's the way democracy is understood, especially we in Germany know what happens if you give all the power to one person.
But if I didn't get the privileges of your president totally wrong, then he is allowed to send troops into a conflict without the affirmation of the congress. The congress has to affirm this after a given time period though (I think it was 15 days, but I'm not sure about this). And if I recall this correctly the second Iraq war was started under this premises. But I might be wrong here.

Michael:

Then you don't understand the US. It is not and never has been a Democracy, we are a Democratic Republic. A Democracy is, in its purest form, literally run by the population, it is also, up to now a very impractical form of government, the people which comprise the population have lives to live and don't have time to spend all of it in a ballot box environment. In a democratic Republic the population elects people to be their voice. The President is not all-powerful he heads the Executive Branch, which "partners" with the Judicial and the legislative branches to run the Government. Each branch has its powers and functions spelled out in the Constitution. There is much debate now and always relative to those powers and whether or not a branch is overstepping.

For example, one can make an argument that many of the rulings of the US Supreme Court are not within its powers to INTERPRET the Constitution or the CONSTITUTIONALITY of the laws passed by Congress.

I will give you what I conside to be an obvious example of a Supreme Court ruling which overstepped and happens to be the beginnings of what many call the activist courts. Back in the late 1930s, I believe, I can't recall the exact name of the case, but the thumbnail facts are as foillows.

A farmer grows his crop, he keeps some of it for his own consumption, he sells some of it for the consumption of others, he gives some of it to his livestock and he retains some for planting next spring. Sounds like a normal farm operation...yes? Well, the Supreme Court ruled that because hge sold some of crop for consumption of others, this crossed into the realm of inter-state commerce and because of that he could NOT retain seed for planting the following spring, he had to purchase his seed for planting. An absolutely nonsensical ruling, but there it is. In my view the Supreme Court overstepped its authority and this was nut the first of many.

Sometimes Congress oversteps its authority and sometimes the President oversteps his. The most egregious however is overstepping by the Courts as they are not answerable to anyone, Supreme Court Justices are appointed by the President for LIFE. But that is a whole other debate. 


Skip

Well, I am of course not speaking for every non-american here, but if you watch the news and listen to what politicians here in Europe are saying, you know that Europe is tired to support America in their stupid wars.

War is always the wrong way, War is NEVER a solution (believe me, we germans learned that), if you do not get that, you've lost every piece of humanity.

War takes so many innocent lifes.

But ah well, politics should probably not be discussed over the internet, I will go back to what i like here, contribute profiles and talk about the DVD Profiler.

Sorry if I offended someone, but that was my opinion and I am proud of being anti-Bush and anti-War.

cheers
Donnie